00:00:12: Hello everyone this is Christoph C. Cemper with a link building and sco podcast and I got a fantastic yesterday and they miss Debra Mastaler Alliance-Link,

00:00:24: Debra who are you what is your background what is your history?

00:00:28: Thank you very much for having me today I appreciate this so.

00:00:33: I have been a link field her since 2001 I came into the industry.

00:00:40: 1999 actually by way of owning the directory I had a homemade directory if you build it that sold.

00:00:49: Organic food and clothing,

00:00:51: and I have a buddy 2 months to 2 years I can't remember and it did very well I did very very well and pretty soon I had hundreds of people listed in the directory and they were coming to me saying he listened on.

00:01:06: Gosh you know everytime I look on Google Altavista in those days are hot but your site comes up when I'm looking for my terms how are you doing this site and I said.

00:01:18: , what I had no idea what I was doing I didn't even know existed so I got a crash course in it from.

00:01:27: A couple of people online most notably on Jill Whelan she kind of took me under her wing and explained what I was doing I was just marketing my site like I had.

00:01:39: When I was working offline for 25 years so.

00:01:43: After I did that I decided that I really like the marketing part of it much more than.

00:01:49: Bennett directory owner which I love by the way I am with directory owner at heart I have a thing for directory but I put all of my effort into opening.

00:01:59: This one aspect of SEO known as link building in so and I work for Jill for about a year maybe a year-and-a-half and then in 2001 I went public,

00:02:09: with my link building firm and I've just never look back so that's kind of how I got started.

00:02:17: And why I got started in this business.

00:02:20: Wow that's that's impressive actually,

00:02:24: you know I keep saying link building I've been doing this for 14 years now you actually talked at and I'm honored to have you on the show here cuz in 2001 with you started I just suffer from my drop and Yahoo stock it out with soap,

00:02:40: about the internet,

00:02:42: that I missed out on such great opportunities and domains are or anything to acquire back then these two years made a large difference in the cost today when people look back and say oh my God it's over ten years ago that's even even even even.

00:02:56: Crazy but I think being around for such a long time,

00:03:01: you could see that development over time and you also saw you know you have a link Building Company you saw the craziness before Google Penguin game end.

00:03:15: And you still doing that right links I still think is that what your company still does you do link building you do trainings.

00:03:23: We are you where I started in 2001 and where I am today or you know hundred and eighty degree difference.

00:03:34: The basics behind the building have never changed in that you know you're promoting something.

00:03:41: You want to get someone's attention you want them to link to it as a result so weird I did years ago might be different in that we did it like everyone I know.

00:03:53: Massive stroke prevention sweet profile linking we did reciprocal linking but,

00:03:58: the whole time because of my background I come from a sales promotion and public relations background I have always worked.

00:04:08: More so dealing with attracting attention from the media and doing Partnerships and in the beginning when I started link building that kind of Link building was not in fashion if you will.

00:04:20: It wasn't an invoke the easy stuff was and now it's come full circle after those things that you just mentioned you know.

00:04:30: Penguin and Panda so I changed my view as well when I changed what I do I had the big agency with.

00:04:38: 7/8 people working in you know doing tons of business right come back full circle and it's just a console again I have several part-time people.

00:04:49: That I work with and contractors that work with mostly because of what I do I work one-on-one with people more now.

00:04:56: I don't have the big stuff and I don't know that you as a link Builder if you go down that road you're doing a different type of building than what I'm doing.

00:05:05: Yeah yeah.

00:05:06: The training part of it is important it's not the things change but the focus changes and I think that's.

00:05:16: Relax you'll get lost and leave early today they don't Focus where they need to focus their trying to.

00:05:22: Himself into all the stuff they hear of the skyscraper link building and all the other cute terminology which are all good processes I'm not saying they're not.

00:05:33: I don't work for everybody in so I am more customized more focused more looking at working with the media to a media outreach.

00:05:42: And showing people how to do it then I am going out and asking people for links anymore so that part is changed.

00:05:48: Oh I love it so you're closing your closing those big deals with probably shows and closing actually all the link you mention that sales background.

00:05:58: Yeah pretty much it's you have to I am of the opinion that it's less about what you do and all about where.

00:06:06: So you can do all kinds different types of Link building actual tactically but where those links it that makes all the difference right because.

00:06:18: People making this they make the mistake frequently that it's a type of Link it's not it's a type of page.

00:06:25: And or type of website so I'm looking at the big picture I'm looking at.

00:06:31: Who are you marketing to what are they reading where are they reading it why are they reading it and then figuring that out and then coming back and saying here so we need to do here's where you need to be.

00:06:44: Search the Chester French.

00:06:46: I like it do you worry about the nofollow tech do you want it or not one bit if you get a link.

00:06:53: Yeah you know most of the media outreach that I do and that one National sites and you know they're not real nice about cleaning and getting clean Lakes butt.

00:07:04: What I say no to a link on them absolutely not you know I think then the traffic comes into it in the.

00:07:12: Quick to race you are also really important now and Link building so yes and no on Wikipedia I don't care on national news sites I don't care.

00:07:24: You know Regular Joe blog.

00:07:26: Well I might care you know I might look at that one but on the other hand if he's the only guy that you know talking about 3 foot toads or something then I would I would say ok.

00:07:38: Good point yeah I got this question very free,

00:07:43: even today in today's calls and interviews devil the topic the question as it isn't raining all the time we have to speak newspapers and they only want to give him no follow link,

00:07:55: address of worried about that and I was keep saying everything else in all that they die is that there is not just no follow or follow it's not black and white it was over simplify to fit in 240 characters by Google.

00:08:07: Right I think.

00:08:10: Whenever I get any feedback or pushback from clients about new sites gently remind them that it's not just 10 people reading that particular page.

00:08:21: Here's the beauty of new sites which a lot of people don't realize and maybe don't take into consideration if you're published on sale Forbes or Washington Post or the New York Times all of these other smaller news publication.

00:08:36: Curate that news so those links are picked up and and regenerated through many many many more,

00:08:43: small news sites no all of them use the following link but even if they're all the sudden I have masses free,

00:08:53: publicity am I going to say no to that I don't think so.

00:08:57: Hey look at that is a New York Times we should write about that.

00:09:00: That's what's going on in the hundreds tomorrow's rules.

00:09:03: Does the funny III spoke about that recently as well and this is where you know it's not about the one link where it's not about you know that the attributes technical nature off the link or the keyboard off of Link it's simple.

00:09:18: Iiic this a lot also where people obsess about you don't that one link that they're after.

00:09:25: Although they have maybe 70 billion links and well.

00:09:30: That put that into a relation that is something I see I see as well I am I'm glad you explained that as an example it so I couldn't have put it better lovely lovely to hear that well.

00:09:44: And I know when when when you do these campaigns are when you when you work with clients,

00:09:52: big medium small large clients you know,

00:09:56: International Global whatever Brands I'm not sure if you want I can put something so that the piano is there someone specific type of client that you love to work with and why.

00:10:08: You know clients come in all sizes companies coming all sizes people same thing and typically the reason I'll say yes or no to someone.

00:10:20: I'm has more about to do.

00:10:22: About what they sell and what they've done in the past sometimes you get people who will say you have been through 3 different link building firms and I've got these penalties and typically it's not a headache that I want to take on.

00:10:37: I don't know I just don't meet you in I'm in a position where.

00:10:42: Thank God I'm in the position thank you thank you God.

00:10:47: Where I don't have to take everybody that comes on my screen,

00:10:52: I work 75% by referral and I don't ever ties anymore you don't find me guest blogging much anymore I don't have to.

00:11:01: So most the time when someone comes to me and I do work with more mid size to large large companies as a referral so people who.

00:11:13: Come at you so you know you're the third link Building Company I've been to that typically is it red flags so I'm not not happy with the other hand you know I have lots of different pair shoes so.

00:11:27: There's something to be said for that as well but pretty much tell when you look at a site certain industries I.

00:11:35: Don't participate in which are you know if your sweet peas pills porn and and dumb what's the other one pills porn and.

00:11:45: The casino gambling there just hard and oversaturated I have done actually that's not true I did you can't believe I had some sites large casinos.

00:11:59: It's different it's a different world there you have to do a different tactic.

00:12:04: There's a lot of melting now to a paid advertising in with link building.

00:12:11: Probably don't always realize when you're reading something sadly that it's it's done yes.

00:12:20: Least common infomercials on the television and we take that same concept that we do an online now to with a lot of content so.

00:12:29: I don't know I just say no to people who keep telling me that they had a lot of problems in the past but I just don't want the headache.

00:12:37: Yeah yeah I got that I got that yeah which makes sense you know when you when you were working solo this is basically your lifestyle business where you decide.

00:12:48: And basically I think you doing well after all these years was 75% referral right with his amazing congratulations on that.

00:12:57: You know I've been very very fortunate and I say that everyday I'm too I think you know everyone around me for helping I have a good Core group of friends.

00:13:08: SEO friends people that you know I just can't work and live without I still am on the conference circuit I will still do the conferences.

00:13:17: That's a huge generation tool for me to participate in things quietly but.

00:13:27: I just don't have to beat the pavement anymore and I'm like I said so thankful for that.

00:13:31: Yeah congratulations what people take away or golden rules do you have to share with people you don't know could be sales Could Be A Serial link building link audit with all your experience this one takeaway you want to stand here.

00:13:46: So if you send any man of Time online.

00:13:51: And you spend any amount of time working with the media or and content generation you've probably seen the change and how people consume content.

00:14:01: It's more than just being mobile I understand that everybody is using their phones and tablets and all that other watches and God knows.

00:14:10: What you have any device I call it your machine recall whatever machine you use but what's interesting to me.

00:14:20: And the trend that I'm following now is spent.

00:14:24: Different people consume content on different apparatuses and on different websites and that's really what you need to know it's important to know who your demographic is important to know that you appeal to women say or.

00:14:37: Poor people or whatever but it's more important to know what it is that they're doing when they're reading your content so if it's.

00:14:47: Japan consumes more on safe Facebook then that's an indicator of the type of demographic in the people that you're on that you're dealing with young people of today,

00:15:01: noticed people today seem to gravitate toward getting their news from.

00:15:07: How many centers like John Oliver in The Daily Show on Saturday Night Live and they like that take a chip from that and when you're creating content in the millennial.

00:15:21: Things to like comedy.

00:15:23: They get their news from that was older people we still gravitate toward newspapers and magazines there's a difference you have to understand.

00:15:33: Who's out there reading your stuff before you can create anything before you can even make the first.

00:15:41: Link Outreach before you can even determine that some links are toxic this site is one month with all of that SEO Basics that comes into play after you know.

00:15:54: Jewish dealing with you understand that once you were standing on the graphic which understand where they're reading it how they're consuming that content.

00:16:03: You can go after them and it doesn't even have to always be content I think that's a big misnomer but he's continent-continent collector.

00:16:12: Don't always think that it has to be content if you have to teach it Partnerships with people that already have established websites.

00:16:21: There are ways to work strategic Partnerships as well where your building links and your building content your building the following.

00:16:29: It's link building is really change from the days when we started you know just getting a link on a directory page now.

00:16:38: It's got to be shared and has to be clicked and it has to be seen in a certain place then.

00:16:44: You know you still need the links less people are linking so more signals have to come into it.

00:16:50: Really really have to know who's behind.

00:16:54: Your message I was reading your content before you can start anything but you have that down.

00:17:01: Becomes a lot easier to take things away so no your demographic and know what they're reading and know where they're reading it.

00:17:09: You don't get involved so those things I think are huge I think that's also think that more and more people are Trend receipt is.

00:17:23: Is marketing to nisha's versus worldwide any time you go into any magazine or you go anywhere.

00:17:33: You'll see that there's a lot more Focus,

00:17:37: Donnelly using keywords but I'm using keyword indicators that appeal to people you know whether it's using someone's race or religion or a preference or a hobby.

00:17:49: People that really need to nice town.

00:17:52: The content the more nice. Content we seem to find the better the linkage people link to those things because they're very specialised.

00:18:02: People want to share a good information you know they want to share fun stuff they won't share good stuff you can be sad they can be horrific as long as it's informational.

00:18:12: And so was the trends in the things that were saying.

00:18:16: And while I focus on what I'm looking for I'm prospecting for sources and locations to host content and you know Partnerships to develop between two.

00:18:29: You know if you have.

00:18:33: Apartment site that you can tap into an email account or a newsletter or you know. Maybe some sort of coupon or promotion 11.

00:18:46: You will automatically without even trying you do build links so those kinds of things that people can just get out of that mindset of using anchor text.

00:18:58: I'm just blocking and go into a bigger set.

00:19:02: You have more success.

00:19:04: Awesome awesome wow thank you very much for that never I figured over time now with minute 19.

00:19:14: I appreciate it I would love to continue for another Hawaii I said we want to invite you again if you would agree to that that would be awesome if sure this will kill it.

00:19:24: Absolutely.

00:19:25: Pull up here I would look for very much forward to the head and with that I want to say thank you for now maybe if there's just one one word one sentence Source One trick or something at just the final,

00:19:39: every way thank you whatever look at this thing before I say goodbye and have the ultra go.

00:19:46: If you're starting out find source that you're comfortable with whether it be a form.

00:19:56: Or a website or a Blog and follow along and try to pick up those tips I have the best that you can.

00:20:06: Watch,

00:20:07: a lot of people don't get yourself stuck on one site you know are in one Community make sure that you listen to and you look around for a lot of information.

00:20:19: Professional learning standpoint I think your site there's a really good job with keeping people informed on how to do things.

00:20:29: Keeping up with the latest trends and tricks and so forth she is even in the big picture.

00:20:36: You still need to know how to do the basics so master the basics understand the basics.

00:20:43: Read around and just make sure that you are a well-rounded person before you start your relief building campaigns.

00:20:52: Awesome alright thank you very much Debra,

00:20:57: Debra master of Link Alliance excited to hear all that amazing tips thank you very much Debra,

00:21:05: everyone have a wonderful day my name is Christoph C. Cemper this is the link building an SEO podcast and I look forward to a more amazing guest to the cost to welcome that right again thank you very much Debra.

00:21:17: Thank you have a great day everyone alright bye.